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Thread: Being really really really slow again - what's up???

  1. #51
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    And interestingly, the process of exporting the site as a template and then creating a new site from that template doesn't fix the problem! It does gather all the assets together into a single folder (yuck!), but the database remains messed up. Doing a re-optimize on the newly created site manages to lose some assets, so it would appear that incorrect locations are saved even through the template - new site process! The new site does appear to have everything intact, as all assets appear on the web pages, and in the Assets folder, but there must be additional links retained in the database that are incorrect (and unused, until a re-optimize is done).

  2. #52
    Senior Member franko's Avatar
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    Hi Adrian,

    I also have had sites with many, many assets. My procedure is then to create directories under the assets folder for these so that the assets for a particular site still sit within that site structure on my hard drive. Then if I reorganise/rebuild my computer they all stay together. I've been using NoF for so long and been through so many rebuilds/new computers/hard drive crashes/etc that it's been pretty much impossible for me to remember - let alone NoF - where assets are on my computer(s). It works for me and I haven't had a corrupted .nod file but I realise other people have different ways of working. My post was more for any newbies who leave files all over their computer and then experience the dreaded 'missing assets...' event in NoF, simply because they've been disorganised.

    I agree there are some things that could be added to NoF to make it better, and that it will never be perfect. No software ever is. Practical suggestions like yours should be added to the Netobjects Suggestions forum so the development staff can pick them up.

  3. #53
    Senior Member franko's Avatar
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    And I hate to say it, but a lot of these issues weren't in versions prior to version mx (6) but were introduced when Website Pros used cheap programming resources in 3rd world countries to develop NoF. Before that the program was developed in the US and up until version 5 nothing, but nothing, could touch it. WSP added much needed functions to bring NoF up to date after a couple years of neglect but the programming involved wasn't the best and I'm sure the current owners are still trying to track down and fix some of the badly written code from that time.

  4. #54
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    Not the first time I have come up against problems from outsourced code. I use an ARM compiler from a small compiler company who provide excellent support and pricing on their tools. But they outsourced part of the ARM compiler work to get to the market quickly. What a disaster! They have now had to obsolete that product because it's just too much of a mess to fix properly. They replaced it with a Cortex compiler they re-wrote from scratch. Unfortunately that doesn't help ME because I'm stuck with ARM hardware! However, I digress from the thread. I do sympathize with NOF over their outsourced code though. Hopefully it can be fixed, by competent programmers! In general, and if you work within undocumented guidelines, and know the tricks, NOF is great. Getting to the point of needing a technology update now though - hopefully they are working on that....

  5. #55

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    Very Very TRUE!, with graphics a [age can take up to 5 minutes to load, its one of the many bugs that never gets fixed.

    I am wondering if 2013 version has been fixed?, whether 2013 version has support?. Versions 7 - 11 have little or no fixes to these issues and I am still searching to this day for a solution, its been over a decade now.

    Fusion 6 and MX were fantastic, I sometimes wish I could go back to those versions, I would as they say "In a new York minut" But them It would be a horrible convert or a rebuild from step 1.

    No Clients left except for me now, and I can't even use the FTP to upload my site!

    Duf
    Last edited by Duftopia; 06-15-2013 at 07:05 AM.

  6. #56

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    Like me - he is probably not a newbie, just his password and signon got lost.

    I am not mocking you "senior member" but fusion is a doggy piece of software, it STILL has enourmous potential, but doesn't seem to be fixing its problems, also I do appreciate your help but its been insubstantial in the long run.

    I myself am still mezmorized by the fusion adds and want to be all in when someone with desire to be #1 buys the company and makes it work!

    Duf

  7. #57

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    I have over 1000 pages on my website, I had to break them down to 300 - 500 pages per site and make one of them the primary navigation site to call into the secondary sites.

    I run re-optimize before each work load I do, it takes from 30 - 90 minutes to optimize each of the three sites, then opening pages take from 3-5 seconds, but in 2012 that began to fail also.

    I put the entire site with assets on a ramdisk and that kept me good for about 6 months

    I put the os on a raid 0 hard disk system and that helped

    And finally I started eliminating elements from the pages like build in graphics placed in there by fusion.

    After all this fusion demonstrates a self-destruct mechanism that gradually slows down the software slowly over time despite all my efforts till its is rendered basically useless.

    With Ramdisk, Raid, Core i7 920, and removal of graphics it takes 5-7 seconds to load pages and sometimes fusion 11 crashes for absolutely no know reason.

    I am obviously a sadomasicist and must enjoy the pain, I haven't updated my website now for months while I play with new tricks I think might get around the issue.

    Any suggestions (smart ones)
    Duf

  8. #58
    Werner F. Bruhin
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    Default Re: Being really really really slow again - what's up???

    On 15/06/2013 09:17, Duftopia wrote:
    > I have over 1000 pages on my website, I had to break them down to 300 -
    > 500 pages per site and make one of them the primary navigation site to
    > call into the secondary sites.

    .....

    > Any suggestions (smart ones)

    Have you considered doing the site differently, e.g. database driven,
    cms ......

    My largest site in NOF has around 100 pages, and that is only because I
    have to have it in 3 languages, wouldn't want to go much larger with
    pure NOF pages.

    Just my 0.02€ from a non pro
    Werner

  9. #59
    Twayne
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    Default Re: Being really really really slow again - what's up???

    On 2013-06-15 3:03 AM, Duftopia wrote:
    > Like me - he is probably not a newbie, just his password and signon got
    > lost.
    >
    > I am not mocking you "senior member" but fusion is a doggy piece of
    > software, it STILL has enourmous potential, but doesn't seem to be
    > fixing its problems, also I do appreciate your help but its been
    > insubstantial in the long run.
    >
    > I myself am still mezmorized by the fusion adds and want to be all in
    > when someone with desire to be #1 buys the company and makes it work!
    >
    > Duf
    >
    >

    Ohhhh, nooooo! Not THAT discussion about selling/buying Fusion again!

  10. #60
    Twayne
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    Default Re: Being really really really slow again - what's up???

    This is a pretty confusing post, at least to me. Perhaps my observations
    will help ypu put things into a better perspective and help you to
    clarify a lot of things plus try to show you where problems minght
    actually be.


    On 2013-06-15 3:17 AM, Duftopia wrote:
    > I have over 1000 pages on my website, I had to break them down to 300 -
    > 500 pages per site and make one of them the primary navigation site to
    > call into the secondary sites.

    What kind of website is this? If you're over a thousand pages for one
    site, something is definitly wrong with how things are structured.
    Unless it's a reference site it's almost unheard of to have one site
    that large.
    You do use PHP or ASP, PERL and the like I assume, right? Includes
    and the like?
    To have a site that large makes me really wonder what could account
    for the size?
    Please convince me the site must be that large. And remember, the
    devil's always in the details<g>.

    >
    > I run re-optimize before each work load I do,


    What do you mean by "workload"?

    > it takes from 30 - 90
    > minutes to optimize each of the three sites, then opening pages take
    > from 3-5 seconds, but in 2012 that began to fail also.


    Up to 90 minutes isn't right for an optimize. You intimate it used to be
    faster and slowed down over time. How long did it take BEFORE it started
    slowing down? And over how , much time?
    Are you certain you are validating all assets, links and so on
    BEFORE you attempt to reoptimize?

    These symptoms sound a lot more like a drop in cpu speed, RAM issues, or
    disk corruption, not having a large enough swap file or having the swap
    file on the same physical drive as the program or malware than anything
    to do with NOF. NOF 11 & 12 have been rock solid for me and never
    presented any symptoms (other than bugs that need work-arounds) on my
    win 7 i7 cpu, 6 Gig RAM at 2.7GHz and lots and lots of drive space OR
    my XP Pro SP3+ desktop machine running at 3 GHz.
    My largest site is around 180 pages and except for startup while it
    loads everything into memory, which takes about 10 seconds to load
    completely, does everything quickly enough it's no problem.

    What programs might you have installed AFTER you started using NOF12?
    How many unnecessary startups do you have? Use Resource Monitor on win 7
    to see what's eating cpu time and run times?

    >
    > I put the entire site with assets on a ramdisk and that kept me good
    > for about 6 months

    That makes no sense. Again it steers me toward RAM issues. Get and run a
    goo RAM tester and let it run for at leat 12 hours, 24 is better, and
    observe the results closely.

    >
    > I put the os on a raid 0 hard disk system and that helped


    Raid 0 is of little value to problems like this. How did it help, and
    how much did it help?
    >
    > And finally I started eliminating elements from the pages like build in
    > graphics placed in there by fusion.

    Are you presizing your graphics for the browser screens? Or are you
    allowing images of large sizes and higher resolution than necessaary for
    displaying and/or printing?

    >
    > After all this fusion demonstrates a self-destruct mechanism that
    > gradually slows down the software slowly over time despite all my
    > efforts till its is rendered basically useless.

    Again, I doubt that's NOF's doings. It just doesn't happen on a clean,
    well maintained system.

    >
    > With Ramdisk, Raid, Core i7 920, and removal of graphics it takes 5-7
    > seconds to load pages and sometimes fusion 11 crashes for absolutely no
    > know reason.

    Crashes are NEVER for "no reason"; there is always a reason. IMO you're
    chasing the wrong things and need to give your hardware and software a
    good going over.
    Do you have any other applications you run that are as disk and
    cpu-intensive as our large site uses? Don't just guess or go on
    "impressions": Get the actual measurements together.
    >
    > I am obviously a sadomasicist and must enjoy the pain, I haven't
    > updated my website now for months while I play with new tricks I think
    > might get around the issue.

    Well, first its sado-masochist, but anyway, you have issues you need to
    "get around", you need to track down the actual sources causing the
    slowdowns.

    There ARE things you can do to NOF that will create some of the problems
    you discussed, like pasting pieces of other web pages or word processor
    or spread sheet data as formatted instead of unformatted, and doing the
    formatting in NOF. That ca cause a LOT of various issues in NOF due to
    the control characters you can't see but pasted into it without using an
    Unformatted pastes.

    >
    > Any suggestions (smart ones)
    > Duf


    I would suggest at this point that you sort of "start over" with one,
    cohesive description of the problems, a full description of your system
    from cpu to FSB, to drive letters, number of physical drives, swapfile &
    location, and precisely what you've done so far to alleviate the
    problem.Concentrate on the details.
    All of course stated facts with no prose on what you think or wish.

    Regards,

    Twayne`
    >
    >



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