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Thread: Responsive Websites

  1. #91

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    I'm with warrenr 100% on this.

    I moved away from NoF over a year ago (same alternative solution as as warrenr I seem to recall), but I compulsively return here every now and then to see if I have been proven wrong. Certainly hasn't happened so far.

    I waited more than a year longer than I should have before making the move, in the hope that NoF would 'do something' - and damaged my business in the meantime.

    Once I changed, from a starting point of a far more advanced product than NoF at the same price I have benefited from two major upgrades (one of which was free as a recent purchaser, one of which deep discounted as a current user), a series minor upgrades (combined additional benefits and rapid bug fixes as identified) and excellent (usually measured in minutes rather than hours) support even for the dummest of questions.

    I see nothing to convince me that 'super NOF' is on the horizon (however far Since_V4 moves it) and I can't imaging anything wonderful enough to convince me to put my future in the hands of them again.
    Last edited by Senior Paper Monitor; 05-13-2017 at 09:23 AM.

  2. #92
    Senior Member Since_v4's Avatar
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    Hello people on this page so far,

    I absolutely understand your concerns.
    I was able to stick to NOF simply because, unlike you, my livelihood does NOT depend on a new NOF version, responsive or not.
    You obviously switched to other software packages, and I hope it all works well for you.

    As you can see from my previous posts, I initially did not even want to upgrade to the upcoming version if one ever comes, and I preferred to wait until the one after this long waited-for version is released.
    I need no responsive new web site because I do not make a living selling from my websites, nor do I build websites for other people anymore.

    I have read your replies and, what can I do?, it saddens me to see that NOF bows out of the scene.
    To me, it does not make sense for Steve to chase after US$29 on deep NOF 2015 discounts when he could pocket the full price for the new version or new software, Koken or no Koken.
    However, Steve may have a different direction than my opinion.

    If by Dec. 31, 2017 no new NOF is released, I say Goodbye to NOF and shall join the wysiwyg website design software trend elsewhere.
    This of course does not mean I shall rush to buy another software on Jan. 1, 2018 ...

    All the best to you fellow fusionists and NOFers!
    John - I am born to tease, not to please.
    For NOF beginners: read everything here and practice on mock web sites first.
    Before asking a question, search to see if it has not been asked and answered already.

  3. #93

    Default A Very Sad Ending - Case Study

    As a backgrounder, NOF gave me my start when I bought my copy at $900US in the 90's for version 2. It was part of my business plan and my professor told me I need to learn html and I said I don't, it's just another OS language - no need for me to be another copy/paste artist of code, someone will come along like Apple or MS with a GUI so I can focus on content delivery. I have survived & thrived just knowing rudimentary code for a website depending on coders who write killer apps (who are predictably vilified by coders who aren't capable - king of the hill game mentality).

    So IMHO I think I can qualify to know this all so important statement by SPM given what is happening now,

    Quote Originally Posted by Senior Paper Monitor View Post
    I waited more than a year longer than I should have before making the move, in the hope that NoF would 'do something' - *** and damaged my business in the meantime. ***

    Once I changed, from a starting point of a far more advanced product than NoF at the same price I have benefited from two major upgrades (one of which was free as a recent purchaser, one of which deep discounted as a current user), a series minor upgrades (combined additional benefits and rapid bug fixes as identified) and excellent (usually measured in minutes rather than hours) support even for the dummest of questions.
    It saddens me for other people because for a few dollars more, this once cutting edge technology is willing to damage a few businesses more. Case and point:

    Quote Originally Posted by garglo View Post
    I keep on getting the price reductions from Steve. He is lowering the price of 2015 on each email over this last year.
    The last advert says " Hurry, this is a limited time offer, and once it's gone, it's gone for good. $29.98"
    Wherever these jack-lighted hopefuls come from, they are now at these forums looking for a way forward. I saw this latest post for help:

    Quote Originally Posted by erlebc View Post
    Hello,
    I'm using NOF15 to create a Layout Region based Form. I've added the fields and a Forms Button. However, if I attempt to use an image for the button I get a publishing error where it says "the file {path} could not be opened. Please check that the file exists as named." I know the file exists and exists in the path specified in the error message. This only happens when attempting to substitute my own image for the default submit button. The same thing happens if you attempt to use the Forms Handler with the submit button as an image. I was going to mess around with a third party forms builder (and may still need to with this issue), but I'd rather go with the built ins in NOF if possible. Time is of the essensce and there will be some learning curve involved with any third party form builder.

    I suppose the only reason I discovered the issue is that I've not used anything other than the default button before on desktop sites. However this site I'm building is a mobile site, and for some odd reason I have to build it larger than I would if it were a desktop site. 1000 pixels wide in order for it to render well on my LG G3 smartphone. The type and images all have had to be much larger in NOF than you'd expect in order to get it to be mobile friendly.

    I did a previous mobile site which was only 250 pixels wide and that worked out exactly as WSIWYG, but I'm trying to go with the flow.

    I've tried to publish using the Site Setting for the HTML as well as with HTML 4.01, or 5 with no differences with this specific issue.
    Finally, I'm not 100% positive that using an image would allow my form to be submitted, but I presume so. I was hoping to at least test this out, but with this issue I cannot even do that.

    With NOF not formally supporting this product anymore (at least that I can find from their site) I'm hoping a community member might have some helpful insight or suggestion here. Thanks in advance.
    Two key issues from this Junior Member:
    1 - "Time is of the essence and there will be some learning curve involved with any third party form builder."
    2 - Mobility issues

    Experienced users know he's flushed money down the toilet to fit that bill. With price being his first qualifier to deliver content, the only silver lining is that maybe it didn't cost more than a round of beers with his buddies. But he will need the time to find out the issues with forms and mobile compatibility to later weight out his investment (waste) in time and money. To those who say time is money, don't be stupid. Time is way more precious and irrecoverable.

    Quote Originally Posted by Senior Paper Monitor View Post

    I see nothing to convince me that 'super NOF' is on the horizon (however far Since_V4 moves it).
    So true, but why follow such movements - if you can even call it such? One definition of a contagion is - "the ready transmission or spread as of an idea or emotion from person to person:" but even that is in it's sorry dying days.
    Quote Originally Posted by Since_v4 View Post
    I need no responsive new web site because I do not make a living selling from my websites, nor do I build websites for other people anymore.

    If by Dec. 31, 2017 no new NOF is released, I say Goodbye to NOF and shall join the wysiwyg website design software trend elsewhere.
    This of course does not mean I shall rush to buy another software on Jan. 1, 2018 ...

    All the best to you fellow fusionists and NOFers!
    If you have no need for a responsive website, nor sell or build websites, don't have a business to damage, but for some reason have time to waste and can follow the movements of Since_V4 - to later join a wysiwyg website design software trend elsewhere, then by all means hit the snooze button. BTW:
    Profile for Since_v4 > "About"
    Biography: Entrepreneur, entrepreneur, entrepreneur.

    Prolific oddity without end I find. Just search it.

    My advise? - Neil Young once said it is better to burn out than to fade away. Don't burn yourself out on a product that is fading away.

    Truly:

    All the best to you fellow true people of content delivery and service! Your reputation and reward will be automatic by your customers who enjoy things being done outside of their main daily chore. As a chore and problem solver, plus a pseudo-marketer of their business, you will be recommended. Online 'smartabees' will tell you, you need to learn code. Street 'smartabees' will tell you, you need to print advertise - but you will not need any of that once you know superior delivery of content, service and market results cancel that out. There's no proof on that except on a renewed contract or subscription - relationships and people at your centre, so centre yourself properly business-wise and independently within yourself.

    Forget snooze - WAKE UP!!!!! IT'S A BEAUTIFUL DAY!



    Time is up. Seacrest OUT!
    Last edited by Beach Ape; 05-20-2017 at 07:02 AM. Reason: insert carriage return
    Never trust a skinny chef

  4. #94
    Senior Member gprit's Avatar
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    As the one that started this thread, and over 12,000 views since, I thought it appropriate to wade back in with some comments.
    There seems to be one or two (or three or four) - we all know who they are - that seem to have absolutely NO interest in NOF, do not use it etc...so the question arises WHY do they bother to keep posting in this forum? Please just leave, rather than continual sniping about the product, and those who continue to us it.

    As someone who has worked in IT since the mid seventies, and been involved in major projects with high profile UK companies, communication is THE key to success in any venture/project. This is why I find it incomprehensible that there is no inkling of what the future holds from the owners of NOF.

    Having said that, and after evaluating a number of other products (only two of which I might consider using), I will CONTINUE to use NOF as it is. Responsive websites are robotic. They all LOOK the same....they CAN exclude some content, but they generally CANNOT be built with the same uniqueness that comes from a specifically built mobile website.

    At least with NOF I can make a dedicated mobile version with some features not available in the 'automatic responsive' website packages.
    Yes, the downside is that any changes have to be made both to desktop/mobile versions....but how often does a website actually change generally?
    I have not found it difficult to sell to clients the concept of a specifically built mobile website..at an additional cost.

    Let's try and keep this forum open for questions/answers rather than nitpicking and frivolity, which has been increasingly the case in recent times.

  5. #95
    Senior Member franko's Avatar
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    I agree with you, Dai. All of the wysiwyg-ish responsive programs I've seen tend to give results that are much the same in appearance but I feel this is as much due to the current fad as to any limitations in the program itself. I've now moved to coding using the Foundation framework from zurb.com. Apart from the fact that it's grid based (and all visual design is to one degree or another) I can design as flexibly as I can with NoF (actually, more flexibly because I can build truly device-agnostic sites with it). It does take a mobile-first approach but that doesn't mean I can't design for humungous screens if I so wish.

    Coffee Cup Responsive Site Designer now allows you to build from either Foundation, Bootstrap or their own framework, giving as much flexibility as one could with while building device agnostic sites.

    I'm just hanging on in here because I'm curious to see what the next iteration of Fusion will bring. One thing I can tell you; Team Netobjects is actively supporting Koken - I get an overnight response to support requests, signed 'Team Netobjects.'
    Last edited by franko; 05-22-2017 at 12:41 AM.

  6. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by franko View Post
    ...

    I'm just hanging on in here because I'm curious to see what the next iteration of Fusion will bring. One thing I can tell you; Team Netobjects is actively supporting Koken - I get an overnight response to support requests, signed 'Team Netobjects.'
    I just got an email from Netobjects offering a free KOKEN - is this a replacement for NoF ?
    Probably a good idea t start again, but why is it free? Is it restricted ? Will it do any porting.
    Yes I could download and trial, but I'm hoping for some comments here on whether I should make the transition.

  7. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by SolarLightCap View Post
    I just got an email from Netobjects offering a free KOKEN - is this a replacement for NoF ?
    Probably a good idea t start again, but why is it free? Is it restricted ? Will it do any porting.
    Yes I could download and trial, but I'm hoping for some comments here on whether I should make the transition.
    Okay just had a quick look - said it was for content management, looks like its set up for photographers to organise photos - therefore not generic enough for a product selling website. ????

  8. #98
    Senior Member franko's Avatar
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    Koken is free to everybody; the corollary is that they sell themes and plugins to allow you to have something different from the default template and added functionality (just the same as wordpress). It suits me fine for my photography web site (http://www.frankleephoto.com/). It's a PHP/MySQL application and easy to install and configure as long as you know how to configure a MySQL database.

    While it was designed for photographers (a huge market in these days when everybody is a photographer not matter their skill, knowledge or experience) but I think it's flexible enough for most other web sites, including ecommerce. You might have to dig under the hood a bit (because you can build your own themes and there's a good tutorial for doing so) and it would probably help if you knew at least basic html and css. I plan on doing this very thing as soon as I get some time (in between redoing my marketing consultancy site originally built in NoF 12 and now being built in the Foundation framework) and probably developing themes for sale in their store.

  9. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by franko View Post
    well done, Frank. I mostly like the sea scenes. very moody. the Koken sites are hosted on their servers, right? download seemed a little slow at this time. how are your experiences with bandwidth and speed using Koken?

  10. #100
    Senior Member franko's Avatar
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    the Koken sites are hosted on their servers, right?
    Nope, you install Koken on your own server. It's a PHP/MySQL app. My sites are hosted at Superb.net in McLean, VA which has massive redendant connectivity. I'm located in Tasmania, Australia yet still get very fast connectivity, perhaps because of the pipeline across the Pacific.

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