really slow site.

[Roger H]

The domain is safe, its just the people I registered it with have gone bust,
but the main registration is safe. Should be back tomorrow.
Well! I've learned something new already. Using the Paste Special>unformated
text certainly cleans up the text, and also makes the boxes smaller. Thanks
Nancy: So how about if I do this to all my text, then see how it speeds up
the site?

"Nancy O" <nancyoshea1@NOSPAMatt.net> wrote in message
news:gmfilt$8nn6@flsun90netnews01.netobjects.com.. .
> <I forgot to re-register the domain for another year. I should be back
> tomorrow.>
>
> For your sake, I hope a squatter hasn't grabbed it.
>
> <I'm happy to give CSS a go but were do I learn?>
>
> Start here: http://www.w3schools.com/css/default.asp
> and here: http://www.westciv.com/
> When you use Style View to set up your global site styles, NOF writes the
> majority of CSS code for you.
>
> <Also Keith mentioned when I transfer text I should do it through Notepad;
> could you just explain the procedure please. >
>
> In NOF Design View > Paste > Special > Unformatted Text. Set this as your
> default paste setting and you should be fine. Alternatively, paste into a
> text only editor like Notepad first to strip out the formatting. Then
> copy
> & paste from Notepad into NOF. It's an extra step which I hardly ever use
> anymore.
>
> <I can easily decide what to put in one .nod or the other, but how do you
> link them together to make one site?>
>
> Your nod files will need to contain both internal and external links.
>
> Examples
> --------------
> internal link: ../html/about_us.html
> external link: http://yoursite.com/vitrual_tours.html
>
>
> --
> Nancy O.
> www.alt-web.com/Tutorials/
> NOF Tips & Tutorials
>
>
>

[Nancy O]

Give it a shot and keep us posted as to your results.


--
Nancy O.
www.alt-web.com/Tutorials/
NOF Tips & Tutorials

[Garret Mott]

PMJI, but I can answer the notepad/text question

Text from sources outside NOF can have all kinds of formatting attached to
them (sometimes 20 or more times the actual text pasted!). This can totally
clog up/confuse a web site - which needs to be pure text.

So - people do say that the Paste-->Unformatted text works well. I'm
chicken, so I use the notepad method. Notepad, by design, will not accept
anything pasted into it but the text itself, so the trick is to use that
functionality. You can even use it to clean up existing text in NOF.

1) Copy the text you want in NOF from wherever (Word, Excel, etc.)
2) Paste it into Notepad (CTRL=V)
3) Copy the text in Notepad (CTRL-C - or CTRL-X if you want to cut it from
Notepad)
4) Paste it into the NOF textbox or whatever (CTRL-V)

This isn't as bad as it sounds with a decent size monitor (or dual monitors
if you're that much of a techie;-). Put the paste from program, notepad &
NOF side-by side on the screen & all you add is a "drop it into the middle
program & pick it up again" step.

HTH

Garret


"Roger H" <hughes_roger@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:gmfnq9$8nn9@flsun90netnews01.netobjects.com.. .
> The domain is safe, its just the people I registered it with have gone
> bust, but the main registration is safe. Should be back tomorrow.
> Well! I've learned something new already. Using the Paste
> Special>unformated text certainly cleans up the text, and also makes the
> boxes smaller. Thanks Nancy: So how about if I do this to all my text,
> then see how it speeds up the site?
>
> "Nancy O" <nancyoshea1@NOSPAMatt.net> wrote in message
> news:gmfilt$8nn6@flsun90netnews01.netobjects.com.. .
>> <I forgot to re-register the domain for another year. I should be back
>> tomorrow.>
>>
>> For your sake, I hope a squatter hasn't grabbed it.
>>
>> <I'm happy to give CSS a go but were do I learn?>
>>
>> Start here: http://www.w3schools.com/css/default.asp
>> and here: http://www.westciv.com/
>> When you use Style View to set up your global site styles, NOF writes the
>> majority of CSS code for you.
>>
>> <Also Keith mentioned when I transfer text I should do it through
>> Notepad;
>> could you just explain the procedure please. >
>>
>> In NOF Design View > Paste > Special > Unformatted Text. Set this as
>> your
>> default paste setting and you should be fine. Alternatively, paste into
>> a
>> text only editor like Notepad first to strip out the formatting. Then
>> copy
>> & paste from Notepad into NOF. It's an extra step which I hardly ever
>> use
>> anymore.
>>
>> <I can easily decide what to put in one .nod or the other, but how do you
>> link them together to make one site?>
>>
>> Your nod files will need to contain both internal and external links.
>>
>> Examples
>> --------------
>> internal link: ../html/about_us.html
>> external link: http://yoursite.com/vitrual_tours.html
>>
>>
>> --
>> Nancy O.
>> www.alt-web.com/Tutorials/
>> NOF Tips & Tutorials
>>
>>
>>

[Roger H]

Not good so far. I've re-done the home page, copied the text into notepad
and re-pasted it on the page, then deleted the old text. The html is
certainly not as complicated with so many tags and things, but the slowness
is still there in both moving objects and local publish (3 minutes).
I'll have a go at making a new home page on a completely new site, but I
expect this will be fast because it won't have the other 105 pages to
handle.
By the way, I've changed my text formating output to CSS. Is this the thing
to do?


"Nancy O" <nancyoshea1@NOSPAMatt.net> wrote in message
news:gmfpa1$9gr3@flsun90netnews01.netobjects.com.. .
> Give it a shot and keep us posted as to your results.
>
>
> --
> Nancy O.
> www.alt-web.com/Tutorials/
> NOF Tips & Tutorials
>
>

[Roger H]

Hi everyone.
I’ve spent some hours experimenting with a copy home page of the slow site,
on a new .nod. I’ve learned some new methods from your advice and help—but
like a lot of things it also raises fresh questions. I’ve looked at
everything in the help files on CSS, per Nancy’s advice, and also done a
comparison local publish in both HTML and CSS. Of course, publishing in CSS
produces much different results than in HTML, but when I compare the two
source codes, (both with the stripped html code), to me they look pretty
much the same.
So what's best to be done?
From what I have read, it sounds like CSS is the future, if it means it is
easier to build sites and keep them uniform, etc. But I don’t think I have
the time or acumen to learn a new programming technique on my own, pulling
my hair out because of simple lack of technique. So I wonder if NANCY would
be prepared to tutor me in the rudiments of NOF CSS, (for a suitable fee of
course), so I will then be able to rebuild this large site and maybe also
change all my others. If you can do this Nancy please contact me privately
at hughes_roger@hotmail.com
A secondary thought also: I assume the search engines will be happier with
this leaner HTML code, and it should enable sites to open quicker?


"Nancy O" <nancyoshea1@NOSPAMatt.net> wrote in message
news:gmfpa1$9gr3@flsun90netnews01.netobjects.com.. .
> Give it a shot and keep us posted as to your results.
>
>
> --
> Nancy O.
> www.alt-web.com/Tutorials/
> NOF Tips & Tutorials
>
>

[Roger H]

Thanks for your note. I've compared cleanups with notepad and NOF
Paste>unformatted text, and it looks to me like they give the same results.
So I guess the NOF method is quicker. There certainly is a big difference
between the 'clean' html from notepad and the NOF stuff. What I can't
understand is why NOF produces such muddled up HTML in the first place?

"Garret Mott" <garret_at_automatesoftware_dot_com> wrote in message
news:gmfpnb$9gr4@flsun90netnews01.netobjects.com.. .
> PMJI, but I can answer the notepad/text question
>
> Text from sources outside NOF can have all kinds of formatting attached to
> them (sometimes 20 or more times the actual text pasted!). This can
> totally clog up/confuse a web site - which needs to be pure text.
>
> So - people do say that the Paste-->Unformatted text works well. I'm
> chicken, so I use the notepad method. Notepad, by design, will not accept
> anything pasted into it but the text itself, so the trick is to use that
> functionality. You can even use it to clean up existing text in NOF.
>
> 1) Copy the text you want in NOF from wherever (Word, Excel, etc.)
> 2) Paste it into Notepad (CTRL=V)
> 3) Copy the text in Notepad (CTRL-C - or CTRL-X if you want to cut it from
> Notepad)
> 4) Paste it into the NOF textbox or whatever (CTRL-V)
>
> This isn't as bad as it sounds with a decent size monitor (or dual
> monitors if you're that much of a techie;-). Put the paste from program,
> notepad & NOF side-by side on the screen & all you add is a "drop it into
> the middle program & pick it up again" step.
>
> HTH
>
> Garret
>
>
> "Roger H" <hughes_roger@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:gmfnq9$8nn9@flsun90netnews01.netobjects.com.. .
>> The domain is safe, its just the people I registered it with have gone
>> bust, but the main registration is safe. Should be back tomorrow.
>> Well! I've learned something new already. Using the Paste
>> Special>unformated text certainly cleans up the text, and also makes the
>> boxes smaller. Thanks Nancy: So how about if I do this to all my text,
>> then see how it speeds up the site?
>>
>> "Nancy O" <nancyoshea1@NOSPAMatt.net> wrote in message
>> news:gmfilt$8nn6@flsun90netnews01.netobjects.com.. .
>>> <I forgot to re-register the domain for another year. I should be back
>>> tomorrow.>
>>>
>>> For your sake, I hope a squatter hasn't grabbed it.
>>>
>>> <I'm happy to give CSS a go but were do I learn?>
>>>
>>> Start here: http://www.w3schools.com/css/default.asp
>>> and here: http://www.westciv.com/
>>> When you use Style View to set up your global site styles, NOF writes
>>> the
>>> majority of CSS code for you.
>>>
>>> <Also Keith mentioned when I transfer text I should do it through
>>> Notepad;
>>> could you just explain the procedure please. >
>>>
>>> In NOF Design View > Paste > Special > Unformatted Text. Set this as
>>> your
>>> default paste setting and you should be fine. Alternatively, paste into
>>> a
>>> text only editor like Notepad first to strip out the formatting. Then
>>> copy
>>> & paste from Notepad into NOF. It's an extra step which I hardly ever
>>> use
>>> anymore.
>>>
>>> <I can easily decide what to put in one .nod or the other, but how do
>>> you
>>> link them together to make one site?>
>>>
>>> Your nod files will need to contain both internal and external links.
>>>
>>> Examples
>>> --------------
>>> internal link: ../html/about_us.html
>>> external link: http://yoursite.com/vitrual_tours.html
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Nancy O.
>>> www.alt-web.com/Tutorials/
>>> NOF Tips & Tutorials
>>>
>>>
>>>
>

[Garret Mott]

Hi Roger -

> What I can't understand is why NOF produces such muddled up HTML in the
> first place?

You & me both. However, take a look @ FrontPage or WebExpressions code.
Messy as all get out.

I'm a programmer (mostly boring business database stuff) & am a fanatic for
careful alignment & indenting - 'cause it makes it *so* much easier to
debug/figure out.

NOF traditionally has used nested tables to position stuff. This can get
hugely complicated when you get 10 tables deep. Seems like their program
doesn't worry too much about how it looks.

Regards,

Garret

[Roger H]

Well I’ve finally worked my way though three days of boredom rebuilding a
completely new site. I set up a blank site, text formatting set to CSS, then
copied and pasted all the assets from the old site into a new assets folder.
I then made 105 new pages and titled them the same as the old pages. One
page at a time I copied text from the old page and imported it into the new
page, via Paste Special>unformatted text. Some of the text boxes were much
smaller than the original boxes, and the html was much “cleaner.”
It also meant redoing all the links and colors, and re-typing the META tags
for each page. I also placed pictures on the pages, from the new assets
folder.
Placing the virtual tours was another very tedious operation. In NOF it is
necessary to individually script each tour and place it in the assets folder
one at a time – total 70 tours.
The net result is a .nod file which is 4.51 MB instead of the old one which
was 29.4 MB! The site is now working the same as all my others.
Clearly there was something very wrong with the old pages, but I’m not
expert enough to say whether it was simply the cleaner text.
In future, if I need to write any text in word, or receive it from a client,
I will clean it out with notepad, then copy it into the page.
Everything is now working correctly, except for one niggling little thing: I
like to identify different types of pages in site view with different
colors, and the color management does not work in this new site, but it does
in the old version and all my other sites. A small price to pay for a fast
site.
I can’t say I’m happy with the way NOF works on bigger sites. I think they
should concentrate on getting things to work properly in the program,
instead of cramming it full with all the fancy gismos, which seem to make it
more unstable. Trouble is: I don’t know another program which I can learn
quickly to replace NOF. I bought Dreamweaver, which I was told is the
ultimate, but after a few days I gave up on the vertical learning curve.
Thanks for all your help and suggestions chaps. What would we do without
this forum?

"Nancy O" <nancyoshea1@NOSPAMatt.net> wrote in message
news:gmfpa1$9gr3@flsun90netnews01.netobjects.com.. .
> Give it a shot and keep us posted as to your results.
>
>
> --
> Nancy O.
> www.alt-web.com/Tutorials/
> NOF Tips & Tutorials
>
>