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Thread: that didn't take long to break.

  1. #21
    jeff
    Guest

    Default Re: that didn't take long to break.

    On 11/12/2005 3:03:10 PM, "Chuck «BeyondFusion»" wrote:
    >Fusion uses a proprietary database format.
    >
    >You're obviously having problems. Problems that aren't unique to one of your
    >computers, but *are* unique to you.
    >
    >It's probably something simple you just can't see from your lofty perch.
    >
    >It could even be a hard drive ownership problem...which trumps file and
    >directory permissions.
    >
    >I had that discussion with WSP a while back when I had a problem with Fusion
    >8 on a PC in a domain.
    >
    >--
    >Chuck Joslin - Team NetObjects
    >BeyondFusion.com - Your Fusion Community
    >www.beyondfusion.com
    >

    Database based on what? Nothing is truely new.

    A hard drive ownership problem? One that only exists with NOF? Fascinating
    Googled "hard drive owership problems" is not finding any results. You want to
    enlighten us all on just what that means? I don't see it anywhere in the manuals

    I still think this has less to do with "hard drive owership problems" [if such a
    thing exists] and more to do with outdated database system mixing with indexed
    services. I have seen once case years ago with another database program having
    the same kind of issues.

    Again, this is happening on computers that are and are not attached to a domain.

  2. #22
    Rev. Mike
    Guest

    Default Re: that didn't take long to break.

    Sometimes I have found that "some" software does not install unless
    you are logged on as the "original" administrator account and NOT
    as a user that has administrative privledges. There is a difference.

    Just trying to help :-p

    >>

    > Full rights but that was enough to get me looking in some other
    > directions.
    >
    > I turn off Indexing Service on my machines. This speeds disk I/O. I have
    > had
    > issues with running Indexing Services on machines that run IIS. I'm not
    > going to
    > turn it on for NOF but it is something to look into if I had a clean box
    > to play
    > with or the time. Ok, I can come up with the clean box with no problems,
    > it's
    > the time.



    I have Indexing service off as well
    but it makes no difference if it is on or off. Indexing does not affect
    access from a Windows interface to save files and name files.

    You have a unique problem unlike any that has ever been encountered
    with installing NOF.

    I too have Media Center but thankfully the 2004 edition
    (upgraded from 2002) and it still has the domain joining capabilities
    of professional. To bad about 2005. Though I find it easier with so many
    networks to support to just use a workgroup instead of joining domains
    all the time.

    I also have multiple monitors using the laptop screen the vga connector
    to a 19" LCD and also a VTBook VGA adapter connected to another
    19" lcd for a third screen. I might even add another monitor as the VTBook
    adapter has two ports.
    Yes it is a Sweet Setup..

    I even installed NOF on my Win 2003 Server and tested functionality
    with Terminal Services in application mode. And it works like a charm
    No problem even as a normal domain user.

    Sorry I couldn't be of better service



  3. #23
    Chuck «BeyondFusion»
    Guest

    Default Re: that didn't take long to break.

    Fusion uses a proprietary database format.

    You're obviously having problems. Problems that aren't unique to one of your
    computers, but *are* unique to you.

    It's probably something simple you just can't see from your lofty perch.

    It could even be a hard drive ownership problem...which trumps file and
    directory permissions.

    I had that discussion with WSP a while back when I had a problem with Fusion
    8 on a PC in a domain.

    --
    Chuck Joslin - Team NetObjects
    BeyondFusion.com - Your Fusion Community
    www.beyondfusion.com

    Fusion Wish List - www.beyondfusion.com/wish
    Register domain names at www.awavedomains.com

    "jeff" <jeff.turbofish@gmail.com> wrote in message
    news:dl5kqa$s7a1@news01.netobjects.com...
    > On 11/12/2005 1:32:44 PM, "Rev. Mike" wrote:
    >>Are you logged onto a domain when trying to install?

    >
    > Again, you aren't paying attention
    > One machine is on a domain, the other can't log into a domain so it can't
    > be a
    > domain issue.
    >
    >>Are you logged on as administrator on the domain?

    >
    > I am the system admin for my company, my login has full domain rights AND
    > full
    > admin rights on my local machine. But then again, see above.
    >
    >>Are you logged on as Administrator "locally"?

    >
    > yes
    >
    >>
    >>Sometimes you have to install applications as
    >>administrator "locally" to get everything registered right.
    >>
    >>After watching your video I would say you have no write
    >>permissions to the box which means you did not install locally
    >>as administrator.
    >>
    >>I would try that. Logon as administrator locally
    >>then add an account for the user at the domain level
    >>"locally" giving the user power user rights.
    >>
    >>
    >>

    > Full rights but that was enough to get me looking in some other
    > directions.
    >
    > I turn off Indexing Service on my machines. This speeds disk I/O. I have
    > had
    > issues with running Indexing Services on machines that run IIS. I'm not
    > going to
    > turn it on for NOF but it is something to look into if I had a clean box
    > to play
    > with or the time. Ok, I can come up with the clean box with no problems,
    > it's
    > the time.
    >
    > When ever I work on a web project, I don't use the User Sites folder. I
    > create a
    > template on another hard drive and work from there. When I checked out the
    > properties on the folder, both NOF 8 and 9 have it set as Read Only. Can't
    > change it either - all changes made to that folder are promptly ignored.
    > The
    > last time I even used the User Sites folder was way back prior to MX days.
    > I
    > always thought it was a pain to be forced to keep my files organized the
    > way
    > that someone else wanted, not me. Just checked out my NOF 8 to see how it
    > behaves when creating a blank site or new site using the default settings
    > of
    > User Site folder. How about that - same issue of saving files in the User
    > Sites
    > folder. Guess since I haven't used that in years. I didn't notice. I HATE
    > having
    > a piece of software dictate where I can and can not put my files. Again,
    > it
    > creates a .nod file without an actual file name.
    >
    > I can go in and create and edit files in that directory using any other
    > software
    > so I'm ruling out a permission/read access issue. I can also drop a .nod
    > file
    > into the folder and work with the site that way. It just won't create a
    > new
    > nod.
    >
    > Another possible direction: what database does NOF use? I have run into
    > this
    > problem once before with indexing service and file access in some kind of
    > outdated database.
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >




  4. #24
    jeff
    Guest

    Default Re: that didn't take long to break.

    On 11/12/2005 1:32:44 PM, "Rev. Mike" wrote:
    >Are you logged onto a domain when trying to install?


    Again, you aren't paying attention
    One machine is on a domain, the other can't log into a domain so it can't be a
    domain issue.

    >Are you logged on as administrator on the domain?


    I am the system admin for my company, my login has full domain rights AND full
    admin rights on my local machine. But then again, see above.

    >Are you logged on as Administrator "locally"?


    yes

    >
    >Sometimes you have to install applications as
    >administrator "locally" to get everything registered right.
    >
    >After watching your video I would say you have no write
    >permissions to the box which means you did not install locally
    >as administrator.
    >
    >I would try that. Logon as administrator locally
    >then add an account for the user at the domain level
    >"locally" giving the user power user rights.
    >
    >
    >

    Full rights but that was enough to get me looking in some other directions.

    I turn off Indexing Service on my machines. This speeds disk I/O. I have had
    issues with running Indexing Services on machines that run IIS. I'm not going to
    turn it on for NOF but it is something to look into if I had a clean box to play
    with or the time. Ok, I can come up with the clean box with no problems, it's
    the time.

    When ever I work on a web project, I don't use the User Sites folder. I create a
    template on another hard drive and work from there. When I checked out the
    properties on the folder, both NOF 8 and 9 have it set as Read Only. Can't
    change it either - all changes made to that folder are promptly ignored. The
    last time I even used the User Sites folder was way back prior to MX days. I
    always thought it was a pain to be forced to keep my files organized the way
    that someone else wanted, not me. Just checked out my NOF 8 to see how it
    behaves when creating a blank site or new site using the default settings of
    User Site folder. How about that - same issue of saving files in the User Sites
    folder. Guess since I haven't used that in years. I didn't notice. I HATE having
    a piece of software dictate where I can and can not put my files. Again, it
    creates a .nod file without an actual file name.

    I can go in and create and edit files in that directory using any other software
    so I'm ruling out a permission/read access issue. I can also drop a .nod file
    into the folder and work with the site that way. It just won't create a new
    nod.

    Another possible direction: what database does NOF use? I have run into this
    problem once before with indexing service and file access in some kind of
    outdated database.







  5. #25
    Chuck «BeyondFusion»
    Guest

    Default Re: that didn't take long to break.

    My comment originated from a conversation I had a few months ago with
    someone who works at WSP.

    His qualifications:

    Windows Engineer - WebsitePROS
    A+/N+/MCP XPPRO/MCP 2003 Server

    I personally hadn't heard of of drive ownership.....but it sounds good.

    A quote: 'From what I understand there's something in the registry that says
    = "FOR FUSION; DOMAIN ADMIN OWNS THE HARDDRIVE".'

    I was having trouble installing Fusion and other programs. Something about
    dll files not self-registering.

    For the sake of time, I ended up just nuking the hard drive and starting
    over. The OS is XP Pro SP2.

    By the way....I'm a Unix guy since 1986. I didn't venture into the world of
    Darth Gates until 1996.

    --
    Chuck Joslin - Team NetObjects
    BeyondFusion.com - Your Fusion Community
    www.beyondfusion.com

    Fusion Wish List - www.beyondfusion.com/wish
    Register domain names at www.awavedomains.com

    "jeff" <jeff.turbofish@gmail.com> wrote in message
    news:dl5vdg$s9n3@news01.netobjects.com...
    > On 11/12/2005 4:21:04 PM, "Rev. Mike" wrote:
    >>file ownership... You know,
    >>Sometimes wintel profiles can be that way. Even the
    >>domain admin has no rights to them unless he/she takes
    >>ownership first and then applies proper security
    >>
    >>

    >
    > Chuck was talking about something that trumps file ownership
    > "It could even be a hard drive ownership problem...which trumps file and
    > directory permissions."
    >
    > I already have file sharing disabled and have full ownership of the folder
    > and
    > all of its contents.
    >
    > I will get back to this later. Here it is on the weekend and I'm working
    > again?!
    > I still have one server to move it's contents, one box to start with a
    > fresh OS,
    > another I'm finishing up now plus a bunch of other geek stuff. It's just
    > easier
    > to get accomplished when I don't have a hoard of users whining at me.
    > "Jeff, can you change the site again?"
    > "Jeff, what happen to all of my por.. I mean movies that I had on the
    > server?"
    > "Is there suppose to be this much smoke poring out of the back of the
    > computer?"
    > "Why is the SQL server taking so long to transfer 12 million records to my
    > local
    > Access database?" "Jeff, the email server kicked out my MP3's I was trying
    > to
    > send home again." "Jeff, you know that application you made for our
    > department,
    > we want to make changes and get it into production before you leave
    > tonight." at
    > 5pm on Friday of course.
    >
    > Oh, it never stops




  6. #26
    jeff
    Guest

    Default Re: that didn't take long to break.

    On 11/12/2005 4:21:04 PM, "Rev. Mike" wrote:
    >file ownership... You know,
    >Sometimes wintel profiles can be that way. Even the
    >domain admin has no rights to them unless he/she takes
    >ownership first and then applies proper security
    >
    >


    Chuck was talking about something that trumps file ownership
    "It could even be a hard drive ownership problem...which trumps file and
    directory permissions."

    I already have file sharing disabled and have full ownership of the folder and
    all of its contents.

    I will get back to this later. Here it is on the weekend and I'm working again?!
    I still have one server to move it's contents, one box to start with a fresh OS,
    another I'm finishing up now plus a bunch of other geek stuff. It's just easier
    to get accomplished when I don't have a hoard of users whining at me.
    "Jeff, can you change the site again?"
    "Jeff, what happen to all of my por.. I mean movies that I had on the server?"
    "Is there suppose to be this much smoke poring out of the back of the computer?"
    "Why is the SQL server taking so long to transfer 12 million records to my local
    Access database?" "Jeff, the email server kicked out my MP3's I was trying to
    send home again." "Jeff, you know that application you made for our department,
    we want to make changes and get it into production before you leave tonight." at
    5pm on Friday of course.

    Oh, it never stops

  7. #27
    Rev. Mike
    Guest

    Default Re: that didn't take long to break.

    that would help.

    > Tell you what, I'm fixen' to set up two new boxes for the office. Let me
    > test
    > some things out with those but documenting each unique step that I make.




  8. #28
    Rev. Mike
    Guest

    Default Re: that didn't take long to break.

    file ownership... You know,
    Sometimes wintel profiles can be that way. Even the
    domain admin has no rights to them unless he/she takes
    ownership first and then applies proper security


    "jeff" <jeff.turbofish@gmail.com> wrote in message
    news:dl5p5k$s6v10@news01.netobjects.com...
    > On 11/12/2005 3:03:10 PM, "Chuck «BeyondFusion»" wrote:
    >>Fusion uses a proprietary database format.
    >>
    >>You're obviously having problems. Problems that aren't unique to one of
    >>your
    >>computers, but *are* unique to you.
    >>
    >>It's probably something simple you just can't see from your lofty perch.
    >>
    >>It could even be a hard drive ownership problem...which trumps file and
    >>directory permissions.
    >>
    >>I had that discussion with WSP a while back when I had a problem with
    >>Fusion
    >>8 on a PC in a domain.
    >>
    >>--
    >>Chuck Joslin - Team NetObjects
    >>BeyondFusion.com - Your Fusion Community
    >>www.beyondfusion.com
    >>

    > Database based on what? Nothing is truely new.
    >
    > A hard drive ownership problem? One that only exists with NOF? Fascinating
    > Googled "hard drive owership problems" is not finding any results. You
    > want to
    > enlighten us all on just what that means? I don't see it anywhere in the
    > manuals
    >
    > I still think this has less to do with "hard drive owership problems" [if
    > such a
    > thing exists] and more to do with outdated database system mixing with
    > indexed
    > services. I have seen once case years ago with another database program
    > having
    > the same kind of issues.
    >
    > Again, this is happening on computers that are and are not attached to a
    > domain.




  9. #29
    jeff
    Guest

    Default Re: that didn't take long to break.

    On 11/12/2005 3:35:34 PM, "Rev. Mike" wrote:
    >Sometimes I have found that "some" software does not install unless
    >you are logged on as the "original" administrator account and NOT
    >as a user that has administrative privledges. There is a difference.
    >
    >Just trying to help :-p
    >


    And I appreciate that

    Both of my computers have admin rights to the system, both I run as the original
    administrator, the one that logs into the domain also has admin rights to the
    domain.

    Tell you what, I'm fixen' to set up two new boxes for the office. Let me test
    some things out with those but documenting each unique step that I make.

  10. #30
    Jon Lee
    Guest

    Default Re: that didn't take long to break.

    Just read this thread and all I have to add is this:

    Jeff is not nuts.

    The same thing happend to me to with NOF7! A rare problem? Most certainly
    (judging by the replies here) but not isolated to Jeff. For the record, I
    am also not a n00b user. While I do relatively little web work (thus my use
    of Fusion ;-) I've been programming and doing various sysadmin stuff for
    years. My point is simply that it is most likely (not impossible but...)
    NOT a user issue but a some strange config issue. This happened to me about
    a year ago and unfortunately, I don't remember the exact details - which is
    a shame as they may help now. All I know is that I couldn't create a new
    blank site or from a template. I could however load existing sites. So,
    when I needed to make a new one (I use Fusion very sporadically as I'm not a
    web guy - have pumped out only perhaps half a dozen sites) I'd just load an
    old one, delete everything, save it and use that as my "template". This of
    course irked me to no end. But, no amount of un/reinstalling or any
    configuration issues I could conceive of helped. I eventually gave up.

    Since then, I have done a complete rebuild of my computer and NOF7 worked
    after this point. I still have no idea what caused the problem but my best
    guess is some odd/bizzare configuration conflict somwhere. A duplicated or
    bad DLL lurking somewhere perhaps? A bad entry in the registry? I never
    found out... But it was most assuredly associated with NOF!

    As the sites I make are personal (or for my own biz), when NOF crapped out,
    it wasn't the end of the world. But, then again, I don't use it to make a
    living!

    FWIW, Jeff - you're not alone. I wish I had more info for you but
    unforunately I don't. I can tell you for certain that I was using an admin
    account for install and usage and that domains weren't an issue (as I don't
    use them and never have). I can also tell you that I upgraded from NOF6/MX.
    My *guess* is that it has something to do with previous version having
    already been installed on the machine. Even the fact that previous versions
    needed a startup utility if you were running two different NOF version on
    the same machine made me suspect.

    Good luck! I hope you get it sorted out.


    "jeff" <jeff.turbofish@gmail.com> wrote in message
    news:dl32d5$rnm7@news01.netobjects.com...
    > Bought and installed the product.
    > Opened it up for the first time, clicked on "Blank Site". It then prompts
    > me to
    > save it, so I type in a name and then click save. I am now in a loop where
    > it
    > won't accept any name I get my new blank site. No error message, just back
    > to
    > the save dialog.
    >
    > Ok, so that didn't work, so then I try "Open from Template" - and select
    > AutoSites/Blank Site/Blank Site.zip. Same thing happens.
    >
    > Then I try "Site Wizard" just to let me play with some of the new
    > features. When
    > it came to the point where it asks to save the .nod, the same thing
    > happens. No
    > matter what name I attempt to give it, nothing will save and my only open
    > is to
    > click "Cancel" on the save dialog.
    >
    > Finally got a few pages going so that I can look at the new stuff. And
    > what is
    > the name of the file? .nod Yep, that's right, no name before the extension
    > but
    > that must be the best that it can do.
    >
    > Ok, so far, not so good.
    > Now I try to open up one of my old sites that I created in NOF 8. It makes
    > a
    > copy of the ntf file but with each site that I open, I am greeted with the
    > same
    > error messages when I try to open up any page: Damage objects have been
    > found on
    > the page and have been deleted. OK
    >
    > So, lets play with nPower.
    > Open it up and with the exception of some simple yet pretty graphics, it's
    > pretty much tabula rasa. Everything on the first screen is just a link to
    > either
    > a pdf or a movie. Guess it will take a bit of time for me to read and
    > watch the
    > pdf/movies before getting any further than that - not what I hoped for. I
    > was
    > hoping that it would be a simple and easy to use program that I can give
    > to
    > someone with little computer skills to keep a web site updated that I've
    > been
    > trying to pass off for years. Intuitive? Hardly when it is going to take
    > some
    > reading from a professional geek to figure out. Sure, now once I
    > understand it,
    > I get to explain it to someone who doesn't work with computers for a
    > living;
    > great - can't wait.
    >
    > So far, I'm not impressed. Guess it's more Dreamweaver/VS.NET/EditPlus in
    > my
    > future.
    >
    > As those who have been around for a while will note that before I have
    > always
    > had little quips about NOF but at least the older versions did the job for
    > which
    > it was intended. This thing I can't even get started with. Dusting off my
    > crystal ball: NOF 9 - the last and final NetObject ever produced. This has
    > to be
    > the shoddiest product that I have ever had the embarrassment of paying
    > money
    > for.




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